Discussion:
[VOTE] Tapestry / Incubator
Howard M. Lewis Ship
2002-12-27 12:24:28 UTC
Permalink
As Andrew has pointed out, the roadmap into Jakarta is in transition. Looks
like Tapestry gets to be the first project through the Incubator.

Anyway, I believe this is more of a correction than a change of course, but
deserves a vote anyway.

Howard Lewis Ship +1


----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrew C. Oliver" <acoliver-1oDqGaOF3Lkdnm+***@public.gmane.org>
To: "Tapestry Contrib" <tapestry-contrib-5NWGOfrQmneRv+***@public.gmane.org>; "Jim
Jagielski" <jim-***@public.gmane.org>; <***@apache.org>; "Jakarta Project
Management Committee List" <pmc-d1GL8uUpDdXTxqt0kkDzDmD2FQJk+8+***@public.gmane.org>;
<dion-2ngoU/***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:09 PM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] Apache Proposal AGAIN
Hi All,
The process for accepting a project into Apache has changed. Now all
projects need to go through the Incubator
[http://incubator.apache.org]. It is my opinion that this project
already meets the criteria for acceptance into Jakarta
however, the Apache board has added this step as a gate between here and
Jakarta.
I suspect the "incubation" period will be short. There is a catch. We
will still have to apply to Jakarta after the incubation and
the process for incubation is not very well defined. There will be a
number of bumps in the road and issues to be addressed.
However, I have the utmost confidence in this community and your talent
and abillity to work together and make decisions.
I am positive that this will be a fine addition to Apache in the end, in
particular Jakarta.
With that being said, please consider this issue and signify whether I
should move forward with submitting the proposal to the
incubator.
Thanks,
-Andy
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Geoff Longman
2002-12-27 12:40:53 UTC
Permalink
GeoffLongman +1

I wonder though if the fact that the incubator doesn't appear to be fully
"up" means Tapestry will
get caught in a kind of limbo...

Geoff
----- Original Message -----
From: "Howard M. Lewis Ship" <hlship-***@public.gmane.org>
To: "Tapestry Contrib" <tapestry-contrib-5NWGOfrQmneRv+***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Friday, December 27, 2002 7:24 AM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] [VOTE] Tapestry / Incubator
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
As Andrew has pointed out, the roadmap into Jakarta is in transition.
Looks
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
like Tapestry gets to be the first project through the Incubator.
Anyway, I believe this is more of a correction than a change of course, but
deserves a vote anyway.
Howard Lewis Ship +1
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:09 PM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] Apache Proposal AGAIN
Hi All,
The process for accepting a project into Apache has changed. Now all
projects need to go through the Incubator
[http://incubator.apache.org]. It is my opinion that this project
already meets the criteria for acceptance into Jakarta
however, the Apache board has added this step as a gate between here and
Jakarta.
I suspect the "incubation" period will be short. There is a catch. We
will still have to apply to Jakarta after the incubation and
the process for incubation is not very well defined. There will be a
number of bumps in the road and issues to be addressed.
However, I have the utmost confidence in this community and your talent
and abillity to work together and make decisions.
I am positive that this will be a fine addition to Apache in the end, in
particular Jakarta.
With that being said, please consider this issue and signify whether I
should move forward with submitting the proposal to the
incubator.
Thanks,
-Andy
-------------------------------------------------------
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Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
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Welcome to geek heaven.
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Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
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Richard Lewis-Shell
2002-12-27 21:16:10 UTC
Permalink
The docs don't help much with what this really means, but if this is
the way forward...

Richard Lewis-Shell: +1

On Saturday, December 28, 2002, at 01:24 AM, Howard M. Lewis Ship
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
As Andrew has pointed out, the roadmap into Jakarta is in transition.
Looks
like Tapestry gets to be the first project through the Incubator.
Anyway, I believe this is more of a correction than a change of course, but
deserves a vote anyway.
Howard Lewis Ship +1
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:09 PM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] Apache Proposal AGAIN
Hi All,
The process for accepting a project into Apache has changed. Now all
projects need to go through the Incubator
[http://incubator.apache.org]. It is my opinion that this project
already meets the criteria for acceptance into Jakarta
however, the Apache board has added this step as a gate between here and
Jakarta.
I suspect the "incubation" period will be short. There is a catch.
We
will still have to apply to Jakarta after the incubation and
the process for incubation is not very well defined. There will be a
number of bumps in the road and issues to be addressed.
However, I have the utmost confidence in this community and your talent
and abillity to work together and make decisions.
I am positive that this will be a fine addition to Apache in the end, in
particular Jakarta.
With that being said, please consider this issue and signify whether I
should move forward with submitting the proposal to the
incubator.
Thanks,
-Andy
-------------------------------------------------------
This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
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Malcolm Edgar
2002-12-27 23:30:36 UTC
Permalink
Malcolm Edgar: +1
Post by Geoff Longman
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] [VOTE] Tapestry / Incubator
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 07:24:28 -0500
As Andrew has pointed out, the roadmap into Jakarta is in transition.
Looks
like Tapestry gets to be the first project through the Incubator.
Anyway, I believe this is more of a correction than a change of course, but
deserves a vote anyway.
Howard Lewis Ship +1
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:09 PM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] Apache Proposal AGAIN
Hi All,
The process for accepting a project into Apache has changed. Now all
projects need to go through the Incubator
[http://incubator.apache.org]. It is my opinion that this project
already meets the criteria for acceptance into Jakarta
however, the Apache board has added this step as a gate between here and
Jakarta.
I suspect the "incubation" period will be short. There is a catch. We
will still have to apply to Jakarta after the incubation and
the process for incubation is not very well defined. There will be a
number of bumps in the road and issues to be addressed.
However, I have the utmost confidence in this community and your talent
and abillity to work together and make decisions.
I am positive that this will be a fine addition to Apache in the end, in
particular Jakarta.
With that being said, please consider this issue and signify whether I
should move forward with submitting the proposal to the
incubator.
Thanks,
-Andy
-------------------------------------------------------
This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
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Welcome to geek heaven.
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Neil Clayton
2002-12-28 14:41:09 UTC
Permalink
Neil Clayton, +1
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
As Andrew has pointed out, the roadmap into Jakarta is in transition.
Looks like Tapestry gets to be the first project through the Incubator.
Anyway, I believe this is more of a correction than a change of course,
but deserves a vote anyway.
Howard Lewis Ship +1
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:09 PM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] Apache Proposal AGAIN
Hi All,
The process for accepting a project into Apache has changed. Now all
projects need to go through the Incubator
[http://incubator.apache.org]. It is my opinion that this project
already meets the criteria for acceptance into Jakarta
however, the Apache board has added this step as a gate between here
and Jakarta.
I suspect the "incubation" period will be short. There is a catch.
We will still have to apply to Jakarta after the incubation and
the process for incubation is not very well defined. There will be a
number of bumps in the road and issues to be addressed.
However, I have the utmost confidence in this community and your
talent and abillity to work together and make decisions.
I am positive that this will be a fine addition to Apache in the end,
in particular Jakarta.
With that being said, please consider this issue and signify whether I
should move forward with submitting the proposal to the
incubator.
Thanks,
-Andy
-------------------------------------------------------
This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
Welcome to geek heaven.
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Tapestry-contrib mailing list
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--
Regards,
Neil Clayton




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Howard M. Lewis Ship
2002-12-29 16:35:31 UTC
Permalink
Ok, all the votes are in, except for Mind Bridge who I believe is
travelling. Not unexpected, all the votes were +1.

Once again, we've voted to go forward and move Tapestry towards Jakarta, via
Incubator.

We're eagerly awaiting word from Jakarta about what the next steps should
be.

I've attached the proposal again, for reference. Although we have to
migrate in through the Incubator, it looks like the proposal does not need
to be changed.



----- Original Message -----
From: "Howard M. Lewis Ship" <hlship-***@public.gmane.org>
To: "Tapestry Contrib" <tapestry-contrib-5NWGOfrQmneRv+***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Friday, December 27, 2002 7:24 AM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] [VOTE] Tapestry / Incubator
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
As Andrew has pointed out, the roadmap into Jakarta is in transition.
Looks
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
like Tapestry gets to be the first project through the Incubator.
Anyway, I believe this is more of a correction than a change of course, but
deserves a vote anyway.
Howard Lewis Ship +1
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:09 PM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] Apache Proposal AGAIN
Hi All,
The process for accepting a project into Apache has changed. Now all
projects need to go through the Incubator
[http://incubator.apache.org]. It is my opinion that this project
already meets the criteria for acceptance into Jakarta
however, the Apache board has added this step as a gate between here and
Jakarta.
I suspect the "incubation" period will be short. There is a catch. We
will still have to apply to Jakarta after the incubation and
the process for incubation is not very well defined. There will be a
number of bumps in the road and issues to be addressed.
However, I have the utmost confidence in this community and your talent
and abillity to work together and make decisions.
I am positive that this will be a fine addition to Apache in the end, in
particular Jakarta.
With that being said, please consider this issue and signify whether I
should move forward with submitting the proposal to the
incubator.
Thanks,
-Andy
-------------------------------------------------------
This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
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Welcome to geek heaven.
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Andrew C. Oliver
2002-12-29 20:04:54 UTC
Permalink
Howard,

I also attached the proposal on the wiki @ apache.

http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?TapestryProposal

-Andy
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
Ok, all the votes are in, except for Mind Bridge who I believe is
travelling. Not unexpected, all the votes were +1.
Once again, we've voted to go forward and move Tapestry towards Jakarta, via
Incubator.
We're eagerly awaiting word from Jakarta about what the next steps should
be.
I've attached the proposal again, for reference. Although we have to
migrate in through the Incubator, it looks like the proposal does not need
to be changed.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, December 27, 2002 7:24 AM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] [VOTE] Tapestry / Incubator
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
As Andrew has pointed out, the roadmap into Jakarta is in transition.
Looks
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
like Tapestry gets to be the first project through the Incubator.
Anyway, I believe this is more of a correction than a change of course,
but
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
deserves a vote anyway.
Howard Lewis Ship +1
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:09 PM
Subject: [Tapestry-contrib] Apache Proposal AGAIN
Hi All,
The process for accepting a project into Apache has changed. Now all
projects need to go through the Incubator
[http://incubator.apache.org]. It is my opinion that this project
already meets the criteria for acceptance into Jakarta
however, the Apache board has added this step as a gate between here and
Jakarta.
I suspect the "incubation" period will be short. There is a catch. We
will still have to apply to Jakarta after the incubation and
the process for incubation is not very well defined. There will be a
number of bumps in the road and issues to be addressed.
However, I have the utmost confidence in this community and your talent
and abillity to work together and make decisions.
I am positive that this will be a fine addition to Apache in the end, in
particular Jakarta.
With that being said, please consider this issue and signify whether I
should move forward with submitting the proposal to the
incubator.
Thanks,
-Andy
-------------------------------------------------------
This sf.net email is sponsored by:ThinkGeek
Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
Tapestry-contrib mailing list
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
-------------------------------------------------------
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Welcome to geek heaven.
http://thinkgeek.com/sf
_______________________________________________
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https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tapestry-contrib
------------------------------------------------------------------------
[0] rationale
Tapestry, currently housed at the SourceForge (http://tapestry.sf.net), is a component-based web application framework. Tapestry falls generally into the pull-MVC model of development.
Tapestry is designed specifically around the creation of completely re-usable components. Components can easily be packaged into libraries and distributed within Jar files, even when they contain assets such as image files and stylesheets.
Tapestry is organized around an abstraction that isolates application-specific logic from the details of the servlet API, such as HttpSession, request, response, URLs and query parameters.
Tapestry is highly pluggable, allowing any and all behavior to be customized by subclassing appropriate base classes.
Tapestry is specifically not a JSP taglib. Tapestry uses its own method for instrumenting HTML that is extremely non-obtrusive (it still previews properly in a WYSIWYG editor). Tapestry has well specified, separate roles for HTML producers and Java developers, and allows them to work together without interfering with each other.
The goal of Tapestry is to shift much of the burden of developing web applications onto the framework, and free the developer to work cleanly and effectively without concern for the many small details of web application development. The primary function of Tapestry is the automatic creation of URLs by the framework, facilitating a fine-grained dispatch model. The bird's-eye view is that, in Tapestry, actions (such as clicking a link, or submitting a form) are associated with a particular component and, through a simple delegation system, a particular bit of user code. There is no global registry of actions, as in Struts, and it's easy to create reusable components that define their own behaviors (in terms of links or forms), independent of the containing page.
Tapestry applications can be extremely sophisticated with surprisingly little code.
Tapestry includes a significant amount of documentation describing its strengths and features in great detail, available at http://tapestry.sf.net. Live demos, a great collection of user quotes, extensive documentation (HTML and PDF) and a recent code coverage report are all online.
Tapestry has been an open-source project on SourceForge since June 2000. Milestone releases (such as 2.1 in July, or the just-released 2.2) result in 6K - 7K downloads (increasing by over 1K downloads with each successive release). Tapestry has averaged over 3000 downloads a month during 2002, with peaks above 8K/month.
Tapestry has recently adopted Apache meritocracy rules to govern the project. The license for Tapestry has been changed from LGPL to Apache Software License.
[0.1] criteria
Meritocracy: Tapestry follows the Apache meritocracy rules, with a core of committers.
Community: Tapestry has a modest, but very active community, centered around a user's mailing list (approx. 200 members), a developer's mailing list, and the Tapestry Wiki (http://tapestry.sf.net/wiki). The mailing lists have an exceptionally good signal-to-noise ratio; discussions typically revolve around planning new extensions to the framework, creating new components and documentation, and diagnosing developer issues. The developer's mailing list is used primarily for voting, and for discussions about votes. A secondary project, to provide a community component repository is now underway (http://sf.net/projects/tacos).
Core Developers. Tapestry has an active and dedicated team of committers. The project was founded by Howard Lewis Ship, who is extremely dedicated to Tapestry and authored the majority of the codebase. Richard Lewis-Shell and Mind Bridge are frequent contributors of components and bug fixes as well as some significant extensions. Neil Clayton and Malcolm Edgar provide code and significant amounts of documentation. Geoff Longman has created an excellent plugin for the Eclipse IDE (as a separate project) and provides code to keep the two projects in sync. Several other developers contribute bug fixes, components and documentation.
Alignment: Tapestry makes use of the ORO, commons-lang and commons-logging packages internally.
Scope: Tapestry is entirely a server-side framework, well aligned with the overall goals of the Jakarta project.
[0.2] warning signs
Orphaned products. Tapestry is far from orphaned, it was originally conceived and executed specifically as an open-source project.
Inexperience: Howard Lewis Ship has been coding, documenting, mentoring and managing this open source project for nearly three years. Others on the team have been actively using, supporting and extending Tapestry for over a year.
Homogeneous Developers: The current Tapestry committers include representatives from Canada, England, Australia and New Zealand; other, more occasional, contributors represent South America and Asia. This is just the opposite of the "smoke filled room".
Reliance on Salaried Developers: Tapestry is largely developed during free time. Many contributions are developed by consultants to address specific needs of their clients, then modularized and provided back to the community (for example, Geoff is developing a workflow management subsystem for Tapestry that may be released into the framework proper when completed). Increasingly, developers are finishing projects with Tapestry and contributing components created for those projects back into the project.
No ties to other Apache Products: As stated above, Tapestry makes use of the ORO and commons packages and has numerous places where greater integration with Jakarta could occur. It is servlet container agnostic, working well with Tomcat, Jetty, Resin and others.
Fascination with Apache Brand: Tapestry has been, and always will be an open-source project.
[0.3] overlap with Turbine
Turbine has a similar model to Tapestry, but the focus of the two projects is somewhat divergent. Turbine is a service-oriented where Tapestry is component-oriented. Turbine provides a larger toolkit (in the form of services) for aspects of the application not related directly to the presentation layer. Tapestry provides more flexibility and power in the presentation layer but doesn't provide any other services (such as scheduling, database access, security, etc.).
Many Tapestry users are employing Tapestry for the presentation layer, but leverage the many Turbine services (especially Torque).
[1] scope of subproject
The project shall create and maintain packages written in the Java programming language constituting the framework itself, a standard library of additional components, documentation, a web site and additional examples.
[2] identify the initial source from which the project is to be populated
The project currently resides on the SourceForge (http://tapestry.sf.net).
[3] identify the Jakarta resources to be created
[3.1] mailing lists(s)
tapestry-user
tapestry-dev
tapestry-cvs
[3.2] CVS repositories
jakarta-tapestry
[3.3] Bugzilla
framework - tapestry
components - web site, contrib library, documentation, examples
[3.4] Wiki
It is desired that a Wiki be setup. Use of the current Wiki (http://tapestry.sf.net/wiki) has proven highly successful in supporting distributed design, discussion and decision making, as well as providing a home for temporary documentation until permanent documentation changes occur. We would prefer MoinMoin, a Python Wiki implementation.
[4] identify the initial set of committers
[5] identify apache sponsoring individuals
Andrew C. Oliver
dIon Gillard
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Mind Bridge
2002-12-29 20:28:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Howard M. Lewis Ship
Ok, all the votes are in, except for Mind Bridge who I believe is
travelling. Not unexpected, all the votes were +1.
Sorry, visiting my parents and just had the first chance to check my email.
Not that it matters much, but you can add my +1 to the record as well.
Best regards,
-mb

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